Talk:Chunghwa Post

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Name change[edit]

2007/02/12, the name will be changed to台灣郵政

[1]

( also 中油 -> 台灣中油股份有限公司 ) Wenzi 16:00, 9 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I have started making the appropriate edits. Name changes will commence once all is official. ludahai 魯大海 01:50, 10 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Restoration[edit]

http://www.taipeitimes.com/News/taiwan/archives/2007/02/13/2003348800

Ma Ying-jeou will change it back to Chunghwa Post and Republic of China stamp. Beautiful Formosa (talk) 19:13, 24 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Notice the key word is will, if it is not renamed yet, why are you moving this article? Also, the fact that Ma has not said anything about this after being elected is also important. However, the most important reason is that Wikipedia is not a crystal ball. Please provide a reliable source that describes the name reversal before moving this article again. Thank you!--Jerrch 20:26, 28 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

http://www.cna.com.tw/CNAeng/RealTimeNews/NewsDetail.aspx?strNewsDate=&strNewsID=200803280037&strType=PD Name change illegal. The laws have not been admendmend. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Beautiful Formosa (talk • contribs) 17:39, 28 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

This one too. It merely says might. Now if you want to put that in a section and cite these sources, then I'm fine with it. But there is no need to move this article. The name has not been changed to "Chunghua Post" yet.
Also, the introduction does not make any sense at all, so I am going to revert.--Jerrch 20:26, 28 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]


The problem with your reasoning is that you think the name was changed. But according to the laws and regulations of the Republic of China, the Chunghwa Post company was never changed to Taiwan Post. It was an illegal name changed. They mention in the articles that the law procedure and regulations were not changed nor admendment to reflect "Taiwan Post." Therefore, Taiwan Post is an illegal name and should never have been changed on Wikipedia. Just like the Chiang Kai-shek Memorial Hall. We can note in the article that the government illegally changed it, but the Postal Law of the ROC is still in effect and gives it only to Chunghwa Post, not "taiwan" post. So, it should be at Chunghwa Post, but we can say in the beginning it was illegally unilaterally renamed as Taiwan Post. Beautiful Formosa (talk) 23:18, 28 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I would like to suggest not making any further name change move here for now. After 20 May 2008, inauguration of Ma Ying-jeou, we can then decide. For now, I totally agree that the de jure name is Chunghwa Post but the de facto name as changed by Chen Shui-bian's government is Taiwan Post.--Jusjih (talk) 21:54, 4 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

We may as well drop the "Chunghua Post" in parentheses. Nothing is going on right now to restore the name of the company.--Jerrch 22:27, 24 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Name reversal[edit]

Taiwan press reports that the postal corporation has reversed the name change because it was "procedurally incomplete" in the first place by a board resolution today (August 1). See: [2] (in Chinese).

I haven't seen English media sources yet, but it's new news. I propose that the article be moved back to reflect the name change once English sources are available. Any comments? --PalaceGuard008 (Talk) 07:41, 1 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Update: the official website has now been changed: [3]. I'm putting in a move request - please post here (there) if you have any comments. --PalaceGuard008 (Talk) 08:37, 1 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move[edit]

Move to Chunghwa Post per events of 1 August 2008, where the board of directors of the corporation has resolved that the name be reverted to "Chunghwa Post" in line with a directive from the central government, on the grounds that the previous name change to "Taiwan Post" was not complete and not valid in law. See [4] (in Chinese) for a news report.

"Chunghwa Post" is now both the official and usual name of the corporation, as evidenced by the official website (English version here). This is the official news item from the corporation's website. --PalaceGuard008 (Talk) 08:47, 1 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

support the move. Blueshirts (talk) 07:12, 2 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Headquarters[edit]

The location for the headquarters should definitely not be "Taipei, Taiwan, Republic of China". The use of "Republic of China" suggests that we are using strict political boundaries and ultra-formal names, and if we do that we need to avoid making the mistake of placing Taipei in the political "Taiwan" which is Taiwan Province. Taipei is not in Taiwan Province as Liu Tao has rightfully noted in his edit comments.

I'm loathe to use "Republic of China" as a location since it represents the state more than the place, and because most people recognize "Taipei, Taiwan" and know what we mean when we say it, while many people will be confused by "Taipei, Republic of China". On the other hand, Chunghwa Post is a creature of the state - it is state run and owned. I can live with either "Taipei, Taiwan" or "Taipei, Republic of China" for this article, but I think a better solution would be to use "Taipei, Taiwan (Republic of China)" or "Taipei, Republic of China (Taiwan)". Readin (talk) 01:33, 4 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Personally I favour the latter idea better, as it is more proper in the sense that it is the official name placed in front instead of the what I call "slang name". Liu Tao (talk) 02:02, 4 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
The website uses "Taiwan (R.O.C.)" so I think that's what we should use, or perhaps "Taiwan (Republic of China)" to be more precise. In general, I think it's better to use "Taiwan" for the location and "ROC" for the state. It appears that even the government is doing so. Laurent (talk) 15:41, 4 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Aye, but you still have to link it correctly. It should be linked to the state, not the Island. Liu Tao (talk) 00:35, 5 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Why do you always come and focusing on this page?! Why not doing same thing on China Post and/or other pages about TW or ROC?! It's really hard for me to get the reasons of your own mind and/or political points. No more unreasonable or foolish works done, OK? I don't wanna play with you on struggling these chicky things in such long time. Whee... --Gzyeah (talk) 06:26, 6 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
No, this has nothing to do with political points, this is to do what's appropriate. You don't mix geographical entities into addresses, it doesn't work. It goes "city, county, province, state"; or in this case "municipality, state". You don't mix in an island in between, your format's not even correct and it is also in violation of wikipedia's consistency policy. Liu Tao (talk) 06:36, 6 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Then could you tell me why Taiwan is not a province of ROC? What about the Hokkien (Fujian) Province of ROC (not of PRC)? All descriptions depend on the methods (asian/western/detail/etc.) that editors use. No matter with TW is an island or not. --Gzyeah (talk) 06:48, 6 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
They are, but is irrelevant in this situation, and you're still using the wrong links. You're using the wrong links in the sense you're linking to the Island, not the Province, there's a big different. In the sense of it being irrelevant, it's simple, Taipei is a municiapality, therefore not part of the Taiwan Province, therefore to put "Taiwan" in between "Taipei" and "RoC" is incorrect. Liu Tao (talk) 07:02, 6 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
As your saying, so why did you not modify the link into Taiwan Province ([[Taiwan Province|Taiwan]]) which is of ROC, but just remove the source text with less understandable reason again and again? --Gzyeah (talk) 07:12, 6 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I already said it, Taipei is not part of the Taiwan Province. If you don't believe me, look it up. Liu Tao (talk) 07:19, 6 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
OK, I think I got your idea already. You mean Taipei is the region that directly being administrative by the ROC government, right? So what's wrong with using Taiwan (island) not TW Province? I never say Taipei is a part of TW Province on administration, but it is true that Taipei locats in Taiwan (i.e. the island, even you wanna say like that). Additionally, Taiwan (island) is also fully controled by ROC government, which could be seen at the link of ROC. You can refer to the page in Chinese Wikipedia, we are doing in the same way. --Gzyeah (talk) 07:34, 6 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Because you're mixing in something that doesn't belong there, a geographical entity. You can't mix two entirely different things in, it doesn't work. It's "city, state", not "city, island, state". Doesn't work that way. It's like doing measurements of a part of something in centimetres, and another part in inches. No, doesn't work. Liu Tao (talk) 07:42, 6 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Jesus! You are too stubborn on that, man. What a meaningless arguing with you... --Gzyeah (talk) 07:54, 6 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
No, it's not meaningless. It's called what's proper and going by a format. The island isn't a political entity, you cannot include it in an address. Nobody writes 中華民國臺灣島臺北市, just 中華民國臺北市. It's called proper format. What if a city isn't on the entire island? Look at Khaosiung for example, parts of Khaosiung is not on Taiwan. Liu Tao (talk) 08:11, 6 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Come on, do not be so stubborn on only one way to define that just by the book. Here is mostly using English but not Chinese, less people will care about whether is Taiwan (island) or Taiwan (province), as well as make significant mistake on that where exists disambiguation links. Generally, most of people just believe that Taiwan is a Region (or Nation/Country in general sovereign term , or Entity in economic term ) in the world. You should try more opening your mind, man. --Gzyeah (talk) 04:18, 7 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I'm not being stubborn, I'm being consistent and proper. Look at every other article, do they put in a geographical entity in the address? No, they do not, cause it's not right nor is it appropriate. Most people do think Taiwan is the ROC state, which is why the link is linked to the ROC article and the link is titled "Taiwan (ROC)". Liu Tao (talk) 22:10, 7 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
In most cases the name of the state and the name of the region are so intertwined that there is no issue. And most of the time, it is the region name that is used, not the state name ("Paris, France" not "Paris, French Republic". Also, for example in the U.S. a very large number of our addresses use names that are not political boundaries. It is very common for an address to say street name, city/region name, state name and the city/region name used actually refers to a region, not the political boundaries of a city. Often it is the name of a city within the region. Sometimes it actually does correspond to political boundaries. Quite often it corresponds to neither. Readin (talk) 17:25, 10 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hey, you going to reply or not? If you don't I'm going to assume that you've yielded. Liu Tao (talk) 16:54, 10 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

What do you mean "yielded"? Is this a contest? A war? Readin (talk) 17:11, 10 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
In a way, yes. If the outcome of the discussion will decide what happens, then in a way, it is a contest. But it's not a contest of who's better at something, it's a contest of which address format is more appropriate. Liu Tao (talk) 17:16, 10 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Having the last word isn't "winning" SchmuckyTheCat (talk)
It's not, but not discussing an issue is the same as yielding. Liu Tao (talk) 01:18, 11 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I think Liu Tao here have a descent reason to argue on this matter. The French example was bad because France isn't an island and it doesn't suits ROC political stance. Taiwan is just one of provinces controlled by ROC (the other, Hokkien) and Taipei city is a municipal, thus it doesn't belong to province of Taiwan but it belong to the Taiwan island. The ame of the country is ROC and not Taiwan so it should be Taipei, Republic of China. The current: Taipei, Taiwan (island) (ROC), really makes this issue bigger than it is and this issue is very simple. Let say Hainan Island is a country and the official name of it is Republic of Nanhai, the city of Haikou is make to a municipal. So it should be regard as Haikou, Nanhai. It's really simple but u can do it Taipei, Republic of China (Taiwan). --LLTimes (talk) 02:58, 23 October 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Move discussion in progress[edit]

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Move discussion in progress[edit]

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