User talk:Tomas e/Archive 2010

DYK for Symington Family Estates

On January 2, 2010, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Symington Family Estates, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits your article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check ) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Materialscientist (talk) 18:01, 2 January 2010 (UTC)

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Home, home, on the Illinois Range

Hello, Tomas e. You have new messages at Milowent's talk page.
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Catalan wine as "a subcategory" to Spanish wine

This is something which remains to be seen, Tomas. Are you sure the French "vin de pays des côtes catalanes" is not a Catalan wine? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Andreas Balart (talk • contribs) 16:43, 12 January 2010 (UTC)

In wine parlance, the commonly used collective term for wine from the part of France that you call "Northern Catalonia" is definitely Roussillon wine. I belive my edit summaries literally said that it was not an appropriate category "for a French AOC", so it is interesting that you bring up a Vin de pays designation as counter-example. :-) To avoid confusion with AOC names, quite a lot of historical geographical names have been brought into use for the "regional" and "local" VdPs, since the departmental names are taken up by the department-level VdPs. VdP des Côtes Catalanes (from which I had a simple Pinot Noir a couple of months ago, by the way - you could actually have confused it with a Grenache - or perhaps I should write Garnatxa...) is one of circa 92 such local designations throughout France, and one of two in the départment of Pyrénées-Orientales alone, the other being VdP de la Côte Vermeille. I see very little reason to have categories which mix French and Spanish wine "appellations" because of geographical situations in times gone by. I enjoy both a Banyuls and even more a Priorat without mixing them or drinking them with the same dish. :-) Tomas e (talk) 00:31, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

Nobel Prize

Hey! I noticed you had written something on the talk page on the Nobel Prize article some time ago. I am currently revamping the article and could really need more hands with copy-editing etc. If you got any time I would be grateful if you could help with something :) If you don't have time with any editing I need some opinions on the talk page on the History section; if you could look there I'd be very grateful! --Esuzu 15:18, 15 January 2010 (UTC)

I'll see when I have some time. Large articles, such as that one, tend to be very time-consuming to dig into... Tomas e (talk) 00:55, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

Edit No. 24 Has Been Posted

I liked the counting thing. :-) Why won't someone close that beast?--Milowent (talk) 00:06, 17 January 2010 (UTC)

Well, at least we agree on the second part. :-) And WP:DRV states that "Deletion review is explicitly a drama-free zone"... it just forgets to say that it also serves as an annex to Limbo. Tomas e (talk) 00:38, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

January 2010

Welcome to Wikipedia. Although everyone is welcome to contribute constructively to the encyclopedia, we would like to remind you not to attack other editors, as you did on User_talk:Jollandude. Please comment on the contributions and not the contributors. Take a look at the welcome page to learn more about contributing to this encyclopedia. Thank you. Tomas, you're an experienced editor. Your comment at here could qualify for WP:Outing. I'll give you the benefit of doubt and blindly presume you either wrote the statement in a hurry, or meant something else. I'll recommend you get it deleted yourself soon after informing an administrator. Thanks ▒ Wirεłεşş ▒ Fidεłitұ ▒ Ćłâşş ▒ Θnε ▒ _―Œ ^{♣Łεâvε Ξ мεşşâgε♣} 13:19, 17 January 2010 (UTC) ▒ Wirεłεşş ▒ Fidεłitұ ▒ Ćłâşş ▒ Θnε ▒ _―Œ ^{♣Łεâvε Ξ мεşşâgε♣} 13:19, 17 January 2010 (UTC)

Hi Tomas :) Take my views in a positive sense. They're meant with a good intention. User Jollandude has only two edits in the past (that was, creating the now deleted article, and another vandal-like comment on another page). That said, the user may not actually be a vandal, and in fact may just be a new user attempting to learn to use Wikipedia. There is nothing which is public information, to connect the user to the group you refer. I do respect your experience in editing. I'll vouch that you'll see where you should be immediately taking action in removing the said information of your own accord on User talk:Jollandude. Thanks ▒ Wirεłεşş ▒ Fidεłitұ ▒ Ćłâşş ▒ Θnε ▒ _―Œ ^{♣Łεâvε Ξ мεşşâgε♣} 03:00, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

Hi Tomas. As this was reported to oversight, I took a look at the contentious edits referred to here and felt that under the circumstances, there was sufficient concern to suppress two of the edits. Just FYI - Alison ^❤ 04:34, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

OK, thanks for notifying although it did leave me somewhat puzzled. For those curious, there is an explanation I did above between "▒ Wirεłεşş ▒ Fidεłitұ ▒ Ćłâşş ▒ Θnε ▒" two edits, where I explained which contents of a now deleted article that made me leave a comment interpreted as "npa1", where I felt that this was not the natural interpretation of a custom-made rather than standardized template message, although admittedly it was far from the best example around of civility when seen on its own. I'm sure it all looks confused by now and I could have avoided making excuses and explanations if I had used a standardized warning template instead. There's possibly a lesson hidden somewhere in there. :-) Tomas e (talk) 15:30, 29 January 2010 (UTC)

Please comment on the contributions and not the contributors. Wikipedia:No personal attacks --OpenFuture (talk) 07:54, 31 January 2010 (UTC)

I sincerely apologize if you feel attacked and hope that I haven't in any way reduced your willingness to contribute to making Wikipedia better and more useful to our readers. I assume it was yourself that you felt I had attacked? However, my intention was to simply ask that you are consistent, and ask you to apply your reasoning to a whole category tree of articles to see if they really can be applied. This, in my mind, is about logical consequences of your PRODs and deletion votings, i.e., about your contributions, and not about you. Again, sorry if you fell otherwise, but I respectfully disagree with your assessment of the notability of the article(s) we discuss and find your argumentation regarding this logically flawed. Best regards, Tomas e (talk) 11:29, 31 January 2010 (UTC)

Well, none of this is evident from your comments, where you sarcastically persist in intentionally misinterpreting something I said, while you completely refuse to support your position in any way whatsoever, except repeating it. So maybe you should say the above instead, and also explain what you find logically flawed? --OpenFuture (talk) 12:07, 31 January 2010 (UTC)

Mankell's Wallander

Yes...fair comment. I hadn't really thought what to do with the page, I was mainly wanting to revert the edit. But a redirect to the film series page makes sense. Swanny18 (talk) 19:30, 17 January 2010 (UTC)

Well, I hope I redirected to where it went. Tomas e (talk) 00:53, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

DYK for Guigal

On January 18, 2010, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Guigal, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits your article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check ) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Materialscientist (talk) 12:00, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

INAO

Hi Tomas. After a long pause, I have begun updating all the articles in the Rhône valley that I expanded a year or two ago. I have tried to access the INAO stats but the site searches return no names of the AOCs I want to consult. Have they changed their website features? Do you know anything about this?--Kudpung (talk) 13:11, 19 January 2010 (UTC)

Are you accessing their search page? This has worked for me recently. However, they're in the process of republishing all AOC regulations, so quite a lot of them have gone through changes recently. In most cases, there is little changed in substance, but often they've received a new layout and are collected in "cahiers" of several AOCs that were ready for publication at the same time. Thus, unless you fins a 2009 version of the AOC regulations, it could be changed very soon. As an example of changes that I found interesting, Châteauneuf-du-Pape AOC now explicitly lists 18 grape varities as allowed (not the 13 that were probably 15), by listing some blanc/gris/rose/noir versions as separate varieties! Tomas e (talk) 17:45, 21 January 2010 (UTC)

Costières de Nîmes AOC

Hi Tomas, I see that Costières de Nîmes AOC is now being classed by Wikipedia as a vin de primeur. I have a home in the immediate area, but I've never heard of CdN producing a primeur. I've also run some checks on the web and I can't come up with anything on primeurs for that appelation.--Kudpung (talk) 19:02, 19 January 2010 (UTC)

I saw your discussion with Agne, and I checked that it is indeed listed in the article in The Sotheby’s Wine Encyclopedia. As I understand how the list in the original reference was compiled, it lists the appellation rules that allow wine to be sold already in the harvest year. It doesn't have to be common or a style most producers wish to be associated with - it just has to be allowed. Tomas e (talk) 17:31, 21 January 2010 (UTC)

Navigation templates

I see that the drop-down navigation templates for Wine and Wine by country are now being removed from the wine pages. Is this a new MOS rule that I missed? Should I remove them from all the pages I come across?--Kudpung (talk) 19:05, 19 January 2010 (UTC)

I haven't been involved in removing these templates, but I don't think that there is a "policy"-level issue here, rather an attempt at avoiding overuse of templates and avoiding too cluttered pages. Tastes can perhaps vary when it comes to this, but some consistency doesn't hurt, I guess. My personal opinion is that Wine by country should be on all "country" articles, but it is perhaps not that useful to the reader to have it on region- or appellation-level articles. The Wine template has always been a bit of a headache, because it includes a bit too much, doesn't have too clear inclusion criteria, and gets changed around fairly often. Tomas e (talk) 17:39, 21 January 2010 (UTC)

Musiklärare page deletion.

Musiklärare basically means Music Teacher in Swedish. I have looked through various sources online to see if I can find any trace of this "supposed" artist. I can find none. But that doesn't mean they don't exist. Before I finished this I remembered I could access the album chart for Sweden online and looked for a "#2 Album" by them in 2009 and I found no sign of it. If they do exist and the album went #2 it wasn't on the regular album chart. This may be a Swedish Electronic album chart if they do exist. I guess I would look to see who created the page and ask them for information to back up the fact that this group exists and where the chart data is from. I can find a Swedish Dance Single Chart, but no Dance Album Chart. From what I can find they haven't had any big chart hits. Bruce —Preceding unsigned comment added by MoovieStarz (talk • contribs) 21:13, 22 January 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for your efforts! The contributor has subsequently been blocked, so that's why I believed that was is reason for suspicion. Just wanted to make sure that it wasn't something I've missed by being too old and spending too little time in Sweden in recent times. :-) Tomas e (talk) 11:48, 23 January 2010 (UTC)

Queertopia festival

I endorsed your ProD with a caveat. Bearian (talk)

I agree that your expression using WP:CRYSTAL is a bit more correct than just mentioning notability. Tomas e (talk) 12:06, 25 January 2010 (UTC)

DYK for Wine rating

On January 26, 2010, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Wine rating, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits your article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check ) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Materialscientist (talk) 18:01, 26 January 2010 (UTC)

The Jan 2010 BLP Mass Deletion

• Howdy, I saw you stumbled across the mass BLP deletion drama via a comment you left at User_talk:Scott_MacDonald. Isn't it crazy how things like this can happen and its only through happenstance that one becomes aware of them? I don't know of any great summary of what all happened, but some is at Wikipedia_talk:Article_Rescue_Squadron#Mass_deletion_of_unsourced_BLPs and following. The list of all articles which were deleted in the purge is at User:Apoc2400/Deletion list, and you'll see that many have been restored and sourced through the efforts of many editors. You may also note that at Articles proposed for deletion, many articles are being proposed for deletion because they are unreferenced BLPs and will be deleted unless someone sources and deprods. I find it a troubling situation, because most unsourced are uncontentious, though they should be sourced. Cheers--Milowent (talk) 18:47, 26 January 2010 (UTC)

I fully agree that they should be sourced (and I think I'm fairly careful with referencing all articles i create - BLPs, BDPs or non-biographies...), but I firmly believe that they shouldn't be deleted out of process. Mass-deleting them without bothering about the articles contents, the actual notability of the subject of the article, or inputs from people who know anything about the subject isn't very helpful. I don't really agree with your book burning analogy (which I find a bit over the top), but I think it is a bit like tearing out pages on random out of a notebook containing the draft of a novel just because you feel that someone is too slow in typing up the notes. Or something similar. But as you've probably noticed, I don't advocate to keep everything, but rather feel that clear subject matter-adapted notability should be applied, which means that some things are kept and some deleted. On their own, individual merits. Tomas e (talk) 16:12, 29 January 2010 (UTC)

I undeleted it - I am happy to help with others, just let me know. Please help by sourcing it pronto. Yes this situation is spiralling a bit. cheers, Casliber (talk · contribs) 20:25, 26 January 2010 (UTC)

Unwelcome

You are unwelcome on my talk page. Don't return. Thanks! Hipocrite (talk) 17:31, 27 January 2010 (UTC)

OK, fair enough and I don't mind that you removed my comment, since it's after all your talk page. I do reserve the right to place user warning templates on your talk page also in the future, should such messages be necessary and motivated, but will otherwise respect your wish. But I of course hope that such templates will not be necessary. Given your wish, I will assume that you receive this message without me placing a "talkback" template on your talk page. Tomas e (talk) 15:38, 29 January 2010 (UTC)

Infobox grape variety

Thank you for adding the grape variety infoboxes as you did for so many articles. These three also need your help: Zilvaka, Zalema and Vilana (as my tag for an infobox has been repeatidly removed). Onthegogo (talk) 21:29, 31 January 2010 (UTC)

I'll finish off these last three with some basic VIVC info as well. As explained here we felt that the Grape variety infobox including wikilinked information about species was a better choice for grape varieties (cultivars) than the full taxobox, more suitable for a proper taxon. But at least your template additions highlighted the fact that we have a lot of grape variety stubs which could use some more information... Tomas e (talk) 23:34, 31 January 2010 (UTC)

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Deletion and later rewriting my invitation

You may have missed this. Just thought you may want to know, an alternate account deleted my poorly worded invitation on your talk page. Some editors disagreed about these deletions.[1] and also went to ANI about it.

I actually appreciate this deletion because I completely rewrote the template. The template was inviting you here: here. Ikip 04:18, 1 February 2010 (UTC)

The Military history WikiProject Newsletter : XLVII (January 2010)

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‘Personal attack’

This is my only recent edit to Talk:List of wine-producing regions. I do see how that can possibly be construed as a personal attack and would be grateful if you would remove the unsightly tag from my talk page, which certainly is a personal attack, and which you introduced here. Please include an appropriate apology in the edit summary. Ian Spackman (talk) 04:56, 9 February 2010 (UTC)

Never mind: since you were not around, I have removed the thing myself. Happy editing, Ian Spackman (talk) 09:33, 10 February 2010 (UTC)

It's some time ago: but if you read it again with some perspective perhaps you could understand what I'm referring to. If you disagree with a single WP:UTW template even after reflection, the best thing is to do what you did; delete it. Tomas e (talk) 23:34, 10 March 2010 (UTC)

Västgötska

Yes, unfortunately that doesn't work and I will start working with as soon as I can; though help might be needed. Fågelfors-Glen (talk) 11:39, 9 February 2010 (UTC)

Swedish Academy

Hi! Regarding this edit: an interesting fact, but Bernt Michael Holmboe is a Good Article, so I would be pleased if you could back the statement up with a reference. Thanks in advance, Geschichte (talk) 20:13, 11 February 2010 (UTC)

Long time, no reply... the info comes from periodically transferring the contents of sv:Användare:Tomas e/LVA to enwp here, but it's not going to be complete anytime soon. It has been compiled from several sources by several of us, but Dahlgren (1915) (LIBRIS record) is the main source for 1739-1915. Tomas e (talk) 23:40, 10 March 2010 (UTC)

I hid it - since it's a Good Article. Feel free to unveil it later, with a reference. Geschichte (talk) 21:57, 1 April 2010 (UTC)

Chapoutier

Just wanted to say good job on the article. I hope you don't mind that I added some information about the braille and I'm going to ask Agne27 if they will fashion a DYK entry out of something in the article to get the article some attention from the front page. Camw (talk) 00:05, 12 February 2010 (UTC)

DYK for 1985 diethylene glycol wine scandal

On February 12, 2010, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article 1985 diethylene glycol wine scandal, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits your article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check ) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Materialscientist (talk) 12:08, 12 February 2010 (UTC)

Machine-translations

I don't see much point in keeping "articles" like Västgötska, Cornelius Anckarstierna, or Olof Strömstierna around in their current state. As I have seen you comment on this, I would like to call your attention to the fact that I have nominated all these articles for deletion. Or rather, deletion as articles. I suggest moving and keeping them as drafts on subpages of the users who originally posted them. I don't think much content of value would be lost if they were indeed to be deleted, but I think the page authors may feel so. In my view Wikipedia should discourage contributions like these, but still encourage the contributors to try to do better. I hope this solution strikes the right balance. --Hegvald (talk) 09:22, 14 February 2010 (UTC)

Commons crackdown

Hej Tomas. Unsure if you've seen or have been affected, but I notice the images I've uploaded to Commons now can be speedy deleted because "Derivative of non-free content: Commercial packaging" (which pretty much can be applied to any photography of anything sold). Are you familiar with this line of image weeding and have you thought of any wine-related argument against it? Cheers, MURGH ^disc. 10:39, 15 February 2010 (UTC)

I believe that close-up images of single wine labels cab be gray zone type of thing if the image is too good, but a wine bottle next to a glass of wine should never be a problem. Tomas e (talk) 23:45, 10 March 2010 (UTC)

DYK for Chapoutier

On February 19, 2010, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Chapoutier, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits your article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check ) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Materialscientist (talk) 12:09, 19 February 2010 (UTC)

Final discussion for Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Biographies of living people

Hello, I note that you have commented on the first phase of Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Biographies of living people

As this RFC closes, there are two proposals being considered:

1. Proposal to Close This RfC
2. Alternate proposal to close this RFC: we don't need a whole new layer of bureaucracy

Your opinion on this is welcome. Okip 03:31, 24 February 2010 (UTC)

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Bryggskjuts?

Hej! Do you happen to know what the heck a bryggskjuts is? I've been translating the article on the Getå disaster and came across that term. No dictionary I have has it in it, Google can't find it besides in the sv-wiki article and SAOB can't even find an occurrence of it. I'm stumped, so I figured I'd ask you :D Thanks for any and all help! -Yupik (talk) 23:42, 9 March 2010 (UTC)

It's surely a slightly abbreviated term no longer in use, most likely a brewery (brygg[eri]) horse coach/transport/wagon/delivery (skjuts, usually written hästskjuts when on its own). Perhaps the translation brewer's coach or brewery waggon or something similar could make sense? Tomas e (talk) 23:53, 10 March 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for you help with this word! Another use left a message on my talk page saying that it likely had to do with mjölkbrygga, so I translated it as milk cart. I was wondering what the heck a "bridge cart" would be :D If you'd like to take a look at the translated article, I'd be grateful as it's been a while since I've translated anything from Swedish to English. -Yupik (talk) 20:15, 28 March 2010 (UTC)

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Re Golan Heights Wine

Thanks for bringing that to my attention, I have continued the conversation here. Best Regards, Unomi (talk) 11:35, 4 April 2010 (UTC)

The Military history WikiProject Newsletter : XLIX (March 2010)

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Help with rating

Hi, I've been working on the article about Jacob Josefson for quite some time now, and I need a fresh pair of eyes to rate and improve the article. Could you help me out? Cheers Tooga - BØRK! 21:04, 10 April 2010 (UTC)

At a quick glance, least C-class, possibly B-class. Tomas e (talk) 23:01, 12 April 2010 (UTC)

Thank you! Tooga - BØRK! 11:12, 13 April 2010 (UTC)

Sack

Please stop your disruptive behaviour on the article Sack (wine). I did not attack you; I said that your argument was nonsense, as indeed it is. Furthermore, removing references is only verboten when the material which uses such a source is not removed.

I have made my argument on the talk page, and you have made no attempt to justify your argument that precedence on matters etymological should be given to oenological rather than philological sources. We have three dictionaries which give the sec derivation (four if you count the Online Etymological Dictionary), and I cannot possibly see how they can be trumped by what some wine-expert "reckons". Wereon (talk) 21:38, 13 April 2010 (UTC)

Nice to see that you're online, I saw this message in the preview of the talk page, so wait a couple of more minutes if you can. You may wish to consider use slightly less agressive language, though. Tomas e (talk) 21:42, 13 April 2010 (UTC)

Well, please don't chastise me for not discussing my edits, when I explicitly said "see talk page". I did write on the talk page after I had made my edit, but the message was there for over an hour before you made your reversion. Wereon (talk) 21:51, 13 April 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for keeping it calmer this round. FYI, today's editing is ending and I will return to the article sometime tomorrow when I have more time. Tomas e (talk) 21:59, 13 April 2010 (UTC)

At the risk of violating Wikipedia:No personal attacks... don't be so patronizing. Wereon (talk) 22:25, 13 April 2010 (UTC)

Asian grape varieties

Seeing the page, List of grape varieties, I think we need to put informations on traditional and contemporary grape varieties in Asia (from eastern Mediterranean to Japan). Thank you. Komitsuki (talk) 06:42, 27 April 2010 (UTC)

Ulf Grenander

Hej Tomas! I added material and references to the Ulf Grenander article. Perhaps some of it could be useful på svenska? Mvh, Kiefer.Wolfowitz (talk) 00:02, 2 May 2010 (UTC)

I'll have a look! Tomas e (talk) 21:03, 2 May 2010 (UTC)

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Thanks

(Tar det på svenska) Tack för de orden! Jag såg att du har lagt till en hel del referenser i artiklarna du också, parallellt med allt taggande av artiklar för WP:SWEDEN. Det vore trevligt om vi kunde få ner listan till 0. Sen finns andra listor att beta av också, jag har t ex jobbat på Category:Sweden articles missing geocoordinate data. --Skizzik^talk 08:47, 13 May 2010 (UTC)

Allt för ofta använder man ju användardiskussionssidorna bara när man har något att klaga på, så det kan ju vara bra att åtminstone då och då komma ihåg att även påpeka sådant som man är nöjd med... :-) Tomas e (talk) 11:36, 13 May 2010 (UTC)

Advice on getting format consensus?

Care to give me some advice here? Cordially, SergeWoodzing (talk) 14:36, 15 May 2010 (UTC)

Åhus Glass Proposed Merge

I reverted the removal of the Merger tag - if you disagree with the merger, you should discuss your reasons on the talk page. Thus far, there is only one comment there, so if you comment opposing, there would be no consensus for the merge and it would stay. GregJackP (talk) 19:48, 22 May 2010 (UTC)

I commented here and clearly indicated that I had done so in the edit summary, and this is where the "Discuss" link of the template go. Could you please explain what you mean by "you should discuss your reasons on the talk page" - perhaps you forgot to read before reverting? Regards, Tomas e (talk) 19:53, 22 May 2010 (UTC)

I read both, but at the time of the reversion, there was not an entry on the Ingman. Do you wish that I would just be bold and merge the articles now? Your unilateral ending of the discussion is no different than someone ending an AfD discussion by deleting the AfD tag. GregJackP (talk) 20:02, 22 May 2010 (UTC)

May 2010

Please do not remove maintenance templates from pages on Wikipedia, as you did to Åhus Glass, without resolving the problem that the template refers to, or giving a valid reason for the removal in the edit summary. Your removal of this template does not appear constructive, and has been reverted. Thank you. GregJackP (talk) 20:07, 22 May 2010 (UTC)

Håkan Andersson (ice hockey)

A belated thank you for the comments re: Håkan Andersson (ice hockey) posted at Wikipedia:WikiProject_Sweden/Assessment#Requests for assessment. If you could, please give me specific examples of what you mean by "[i]t's more written like a profile for a magazine (e.g. the quotations and some "trivia"-like info) than our typical slightly "drier" encyclopedic articles". I imagine you're saying get rid of the quote boxes, which is fine, originally they were there due to a lack of pictures, but I'm not sure what information is trivial. Cheers Rejectwater (talk) 00:56, 31 May 2010 (UTC)

Talk:Côte-Rôtie AOC

Talk:Côte-Rôtie AOC. Tomas, I wonder if I could ask for your univolved opinion. I clearly stated my reasons for dewikifying several links in the text, but I feel that an editor is spoiling for an edit war. My edits as far as I can ascetain, were perfectly in accordance with WP:OVERLINK:

• Do not link to a page that redirects back to the page the link is on.
• avoid linking terms whose meaning can be understood by most readers of the English Wikipedia, including plain English words
• always consider providing a concise definition instead of or in addition to a link to another article.'

if you think I was wrong, do let me know - it will help my further patrolling of wine articles. Thanks. --Kudpung (talk) 02:34, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

The editor is me, and I'm in no way edit warring, I just think you are wrong, I will not revert you again, but I do want a uninvolved opinion. Tomas, please answer at Talk:Côte-Rôtie AOC. --Stefan ^talk 04:06, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

Sorry for the delay of a couple of days, but I've now replied at the article's talk page. Tomas e (talk) 23:21, 6 June 2010 (UTC)

Dom Pérignon (wine)

Hello Tomas_e. I'm sorry but I didn't really understand what was wrong in the page and so why you had to modify it... Indeed it's a lot like the french page because I did modified this one too. And so is it forbidden to make proper translation from a language to another ? It must be different ? Thanks for your explanations, as you may have seen I'm a Wikipedia noob ! Vincent (talk) 15:09, 02 June 2010 (UTC)

It's not forbidden, but a lot of the content was not quite in line with our policies. Since it clearly seemed to come from French Wikipieda I tried to explain how our practices differ so you understand why your contibutions were "pruned". Those of us who regularly edit wine articles often see "too enthusiastic phrases" and "flowery language" used, and regularly try to bring it in line with policies. Regards, Tomas e (talk) 12:38, 3 June 2010 (UTC)

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Talkback

Hello, Tomas e. You have new messages at Talk:Coteaux du Tricastin AOC.
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Retired

Hi Tomas. Thank you for all the encouragement you have given me over the years since I first entered the domaine of Wikipdea wine. I always firmly believed it was a Wiki policy to encourage editors to be as productive as possible and to follow the guidelines, but as you know, I have retired from the WP:WINE due to inappropriate comments from some of our colleagues here. I might occasionally continue to stab at a Rhône articles, but without any enthusiasm, and without anymore taking the initiative to be bold and do redirect, moves, and merges, etc. There is too much to fear from the acid tones of some of the other contributors who practically lay claims to ownership of the wine project. In future therefore, I will sometimes make suggestions for improvements or expansions to articles, but I will rely on others making the decisions and doing the actual work. --Kudpung (talk) 08:19, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

You are now a Reviewer

Hello. Your account has been granted the "reviewer" userright, allowing you to review other users' edits on certain flagged pages. Pending changes, also known as flagged protection, will be commencing a two-month trial at approximately 23:00, 2010 June 15 (UTC).

Reviewers can review edits made by users who are not autoconfirmed to articles placed under flagged protection. Flagged protection is applied to only a small number of articles, similarly to how semi-protection is applied but in a more controlled way for the trial.

When reviewing, edits should be accepted if they are not obvious vandalism or BLP violations, and not clearly problematic in light of the reason given for protection (see Wikipedia:Reviewing process). More detailed documentation and guidelines can be found here.

If you do not want this userright, you may ask any administrator to remove it for you at any time. Courcelles (talk) 20:31, 15 June 2010 (UTC)

Burgundy wine

I'm sorry, but I don't understand how what I edited was not minor or what was wrong with it in general to be undone. Before I edited, the text displayed as "in [13], but" with an incorrectly placed inline citation and I changed it to "in,[13] but". Please let me know so I can avoid doing it again in the future. Erianna (talk) 01:11, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

My apologies, I actually thought you had removed the statement "but this is not widely practiced today" (which would have made it non-minor), thus my probably completely incomprehensible edit comment "a relevant statement to include". But I now see you definitely didn't! The differerent line break in this view and obviously not looking close enough apparently fooled me. Very sorry about that - I naturally removed the misplaced message from your user talk page. Best regards, Tomas e (talk) 10:21, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

Winemakers categories

Opps, I forgot that :-), thanks, will do that, in the future, but do not expect any fast progress, will do a few now and then, it is VERY boring work :-) --Stefan ^talk 00:25, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

Hum, looks like I was reverted .... see [2]. --Stefan ^talk 00:39, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

DYK for André Jullien

— Rlevse • Talk • 18:02, 24 June 2010 (UTC)

Occitan wine

Nominated for deletion, for info. I hope I've done it right .. N-HH talk/edits 20:44, 27 June 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for notifying! Tomas e (talk) 20:59, 27 June 2010 (UTC)

Obesity in Sweden

Do you know any other english language news sites? I can't find anymore. Kingjeff (talk) 20:39, 28 June 2010 (UTC)

Hello Kingjeff, the article came up in the list of new articles for WP:SWEDEN (which I sometimes visit), so I just added a project tag, tweaked its categories and noted that there was no similar article existed in Swedish Wikipedia. I didn't check for news sources and I see that you've already found The Local, which tends to be the best for "small news" in English from Sweden. If you want to be ambitious, perhaps you could try to google for Fetma i Sverige (the Swedish term for "Obesity in Sweden") and then use Google translate? Or Google translate this page on child obesity from a government agency. Tomas e (talk) 20:50, 28 June 2010 (UTC)

Svante Janson

Editor QWPFY and I have made some updates to the English article on Svante Janson. In particular, I added pictures of Diaconis and Carleson, and also some references, which may be useful on the Swedish page (from which I translated some material, leaving out the marriage noted on Janson's homepage.) Mvh, Kiefer.Wolfowitz (talk) 19:58, 29 June 2010 (UTC)

OK, thanks, will bear it in mind for any expansion. And, yes, the family details we usually don't include in academic biographies on svwiki either. Tomas e (talk) 21:08, 29 June 2010 (UTC)

Swedish Wikipedia includes such details now: "Janson gifte sig 1986 med Julie White och fick 1995 dottern Sofie.", I'll mention. Mvh, Kiefer.Wolfowitz (talk) 20:19, 6 July 2010 (UTC)

DYK for Glera (grape)

— Rlevse • Talk • 00:02, 30 June 2010 (UTC)

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English Wikipedia

Hello! Since you are originally a Swedish Wikipedian and have been editing a lot there earlier, you have now gone over to EnWp? Why did you do that? If Swedish is your native language, then why don't you edit there during the majority of your leisure?

Also, I thought you was (at least have been) an administrator on Swedish Wikipedia, but I was mistoken. Or am I wrong? What I do know is you are currently not an administrator there. /HeyMid (contributions) 17:53, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

Hello, yes I'm Swedish and a native Swedish speaker (see Babel box). I've been dividing my time between the Swedish and English language version ever since 2007, and I'm still active in both, but with slightly different "editing profiles" and varying intensity - sometimes I take a break. Participation in these two language versions has its different pros and cons. Quite a high proportion of my number of edits here are related to WP:SWEDEN, as I periodically a lot of assessment and new article patrolling for that project, i.e, a bit of number-of-edits-intense "housekeeping" tasks. Being able to read Swedish-language sources and finding interwiki links to Swedish Wikipedia is fairly useful when working in that project... :-) I'm not an admin in either version (and have never applied for admin rights), but I'm a rollbacker in both versions. Tomas e (talk) 18:09, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

Hello again! I just found out why I asked you this. You commented on BjörnBergman's talk page on english Wikipedia on [3] (you later corrected it to January) and [4]. You also commented his permanent block at the time (now his block is set for 3 years) on WP:KAW on Swedish Wikipedia both here and here (plus some more messages on the same place), which made me wonder if you are an administrator on Wikipedia, because you entered the meta discussions. /HeyMid (contributions) 14:46, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

No, this was more related to the fact that I've edited in both versions and has seen differences in attitude/culture, and wanted to underline this to Björn. (It's probably easier to be blocked in enwp using svwp habits, than the other way around.) If anyone ignores repeated standardised warning messages (which are much more numerous here) over a short period of time, they tend to get blocked, also for other things than simple vandalism. I do however notice that nowadays, he tends to add a reference to the BLP articles he creates (mostly film actor stubs), so in this case, the message seems finally to have come across, which is good. Tomas e (talk) 15:20, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

No problem. However, in the SvWp case, this wasn't the reason as to why he got blocked from there. Like: He sometimes used the K2 template instead of K0 or K1; he sometimes forgot to sign his messages and warning templates; and he did not listen to the other users and administrators's advices and criticism. Thank you. /HeyMid (contributions) 18:30, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

EDIT: I forgot to say that BjörnBergman has not edited anything ever since June 17, 2010. What could be the cause? Is it due to summer vacation? /HeyMid (contributions) 18:32, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

No idea. Tomas e (talk) 18:36, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

I am glad that editor Hey clarified the innocent concerns. However, the first message's suggestion that multilingual editors focus their talents elsewhere

Since you are originally a Swedish Wikipedian and have been editing a lot there earlier, you have now gone over to EnWp? Why did you do that? If Swedish is your native language, then why don't you edit there during the majority of your leisure?

was poorly worded, unintentionally, imho; I hope that it will be revised graciously (and then I would remove this comment).

Thanks! Best regards, Kiefer.Wolfowitz (talk) 18:57, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

While not the most common type of question, I didn't give it any "agressive" interpretation at all, I only saw it as a bit odd and a bit more "curious and survey-like" - so from my point of view no rephrasing is needed. I could understand how it could be interpreted otherwise if it followed some sort of disagreement on some other pages, but that's not the case... I think. :-) Tomas e (talk) 19:05, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

Just wanted to note that Heymid (talk · contribs) has been warned not to pester svwp contributors about contentious svwp issues (like BB's ban/block) on enwp. Of course, if you do not mind it, it's not much of an issue. Regards, decltype (talk) 21:31, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

Please don't bother. I was just wondering. Also, I was just telling him that was not the reason as to why the user got blocked from editing on SvWp. And sorry, I am not a native English language speaker. I am natively speaking Swedish. Thanks, /HeyMid (contributions) 10:48, 15 July 2010 (UTC)

"Personal Analysis"

Tomas, I believe you are misunderstanding the intent of WP:NOR and WP:NPOV, I strongly suggest that you reread the policies thoroughly and carefully. These policies are intended to be applied to Wikipedia Articles, and as such are not applied to Talk pages. Furthermore, It is explicitly and unambiguously stated that comments in Wikipeida's Talk pages should not be removed without the Author's permission . My comment was indeed relevant to improving the article, as I mention several points that were not addressed in sufficient detail. The next step in editing would be to find reliable sources for these points. Please observe The guidelines as stated in WP:TPG. You will find yourself far less often getting into edit wars and more often being engaged in polite discussion of the article's subject matter and quality. Thank you for your productive edits, and best of luck in your future edits! :-) 67.142.172.31 (talk) 15:24, 16 July 2010 (UTC)

A very late comment, but where did actually you get the italicised statement about talk pages from? Are you possibly quoting one out of 16 bullet points about when it is appropriate to edit other editor's comments, and treating it as the only one? Your interpretation definitely goes against the type of talk page additions that result in Template:Uw-chat1 and up to 4, and vandal additions to talk pages are definitely deleted on sight without consultation of the authors! More specifically, direct quotes from the pages linked from the Uw-chat series of templates are:

• "Material unsuitable for talk pages may be subject to removal per the talk page guidelines."
• "Keep discussions focused on how to improve the article. Irrelevant discussions are subject to removal."
• "Do not use the talk page as a forum or soapbox for discussing the topic. The talk page is for discussing how to improve the article."

Tomas e (talk) 20:55, 7 August 2010 (UTC)

I see that you have taken three bullet points from WP:TPG, It's difficult to discern from your comment precisely what the essence of your argument is, but in any case, the comment in question did not run afoul of any of those guidelines. 67.142.172.25 (talk) 05:57, 30 December 2010 (UTC)

Since it's been five months, could you provide a link to the talk page in question? Did I actually remove material related to improving the article, or was it someone who was spamming the talk page with general discussion or commercial material that wouldn't be allowed in the actual article? Tomas e (talk) 15:03, 30 December 2010 (UTC)

B. Frtiz

Thank you very much for your help sourcing the article I started. I need to learn how to do that myself, I guess. Donald Schroeder JWH018 (talk) 03:00, 30 July 2010 (UTC)

You're welcome! Tomas e (talk) 20:56, 7 August 2010 (UTC)

Schramsberg

Frankly I don't want to get into a debate over whether for the purposes of a Wikipedia category that "California Sparkling Wine" producers should be segmented from "Champagne producers". I didn't really like the tone of your post on my talk page - fairly condescending - of course i am trying to be helpful. Anyway, I don't think this is a lack of understanding but rather an intent to get the article in its proper category. For purposes of someone using Wikipedia it would probably be more helpful to find Schramsberg in the category or have separate categories and discern the difference which appears to be addressed in the Schramsberg article itself. Not sure your perspective, but I thought your edits were overly harsh - the "advert" tag first of all, then ascribing a low importance rating, then removing the categorization. I am not really involved with the article or this topic but I am familiar enough with the brand. I used to live in SF and this is a very famous producer - not so much within the wine community but rather because it is effectively the exclusive "sparkling wine" producer of the White House and U.S. government. That is why I did not think this fits within "Subject is not particularly notable or significant even within its field of study. It may only be included to cover a specific part of a notable article" where you placed it. I see no conditionality putting wine producers in this category - I could see a random producer having low notability but I am not a wine person and this is a brand that even I have heard of. Finally, rather than placing an advert tag on the article, I would suggest you point out / fix the specific issues that you consider objectionable. This is mostly a historical article which almost by definition cannot be advertising. |► ϋrбanяeneωaℓ • TALK ◄| 23:34, 7 August 2010 (UTC)

(Oh, I didn't realise it had been this long since I checked out my talk page?) Sorry to hear that you took offence at my edit comments. I might add that of the wine-related articles, those on wineries almost invariably need a close scrutiny for relevance and style of writing, and show various issues. There is, however, no doubt whatsoever that Category:Champagne producers is a category for producers of Champagne (wine), the French protected designation of origin located in Champagne (wine region), and not to producers of Californian sparkling wine. Tomas e (talk) 18:26, 23 August 2010 (UTC)

Hello, Tomas e. You have new messages at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of urban areas in the Nordic countries.
Message added Maashatra11 (talk) 20:22, 10 August 2010 (UTC). You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

The Military history WikiProject Newsletter : LIII (July 2010)

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Scania

I have given an answer to your rude comment about almost-vandalism at Talk:Skåne County. Please use a civilized tone. This is Wikipedia, not your average youth discussion board. John Anderson (talk) 19:09, 19 August 2010 (UTC)

Dear John, you should check out sources before moving articles to erroneous names, and introducing factual error into their text. You did not do this, and you did obviously not check out the article's history, since this topic had been covered before. My comments was completely factual, and not rude, and I'm sorry to hear that you interpreted it this way. Naturally I point out the error you have made when I write my edit comments. Tomas e (talk) 18:35, 23 August 2010 (UTC)

John Anderson is still moving articles. How should we cope with this problem? I agree with the principle using the exonym Scania when referring to the historical province, but Skåne County talking about the modern administrative entity.--Muniswede (talk) 21:37, 7 October 2010 (UTC)

Mark deSilca

Well spotted as a hoax - what drew it to your attention? I did some more digging, and found enough evidence to get it speedy-deleted - the author gave a long quote from a journal article, but the contents list for that issue of the journal is available on-line, and there was no such article; also, there were cross-references between this article and an even more blatant hoax "Quantum Police" by a different author - either a sock, or tag-teaming on the hoaxes. I will take a close look at their other contributions. Regards, JohnCD (talk) 08:24, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

I often do new article patrolling for WP:SWEDEN, and the image caption in the article had the word "Swedish" in it, so I found it when I went through the project's recent backlog as created of AlexNewArtBot. It was clear that it shouldn't be tagged for that project, but the combination of psychoanalysis and theoretical physics made it look weird and in need of a closer look. The "Quantum Police" plus a bogus French interwiki link on top of that definitely set off my "hoax sensor" so I PRODded it. Tomas e (talk) 22:26, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

stub – start

Hi again, Tomas e! Which types of articles do you personally prefer to have on stub and start, respectively? /HeyMid (contributions) 20:04, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

Oups, I was assessing/reassessing several articles over the last couple of days so I'm not sure exactly which one you mean? Possibly a sports biography? There is clearly a gray zone, where it perhaps doesn't matter which one you choose. A lot of articles have been classified stub by default when project tagged. I usually make a quick check for length, proper writing and layout, references and any "article issues". Length of course has to be assessed in relation to the scope of the article (in particular when going to C-class and above). For a rather "narrow" biography, I would say that an article that is referenced, has a proper layout, no obvious copyediting needs or article issues, is start-class if it is 3 kb+ in size, of which a reasonable proportion is body text. This is of course only a rough guideline; if there are interwiki links and large amount of reference syntax, mostly empty infobox syntax or tables, an article can be 5 kb but still be stub. I do however consider start-class to be a rather wide category. I've probably been more restrictive in going from start to C than from stub to start for WPSweden. In my opinion, stub-class in principle always indicates that the article needs attention and further work to be acceptable. A start-class is an article that you can actually live with for a less notable subject, i.e. low-importance articles. For mid-importance articles and above, articles "should be" C-class or above. Then there is of course the Wikipedia:WikiProject_Sweden/Assessment#Quality_scale, but that's fairly general rather than project-specific. Tomas e (talk) 11:56, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

Johannes Browallius

Thanks for putting this right Tomas. You might like to look at Critica Botanica and Fundamenta Botanica.Granitethighs 01:22, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

Well, when I found the Johannis B. article I had the feeling that an associate of Linnæus cum 18th century Church of Sweden bishop was more-or-less guaranteed to have an article in Swedish Wikipedia. When I looked for something to interwiki-link to I noted that he was already present in English Wikipedia as Johannes Browallius. Just an example of New Article Patrolling for Sweden-related articles. Will have a look at the two you mentioned, although I only tend to fix basic things like missing categories, interwiki links and project tags in these sweeps. Tomas e (talk) 11:02, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

The Military history WikiProject Newsletter : LIV (August 2010)

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The Military history WikiProject coordinator election has started. You are cordially invited to help pick fourteen new coordinators from a pool of twenty candidates. This time round, the term has increased from six to twelve months so it is doubly important that you have your say! Please cast your vote here no later than 23:59 (UTC) on Tuesday, 28 September 2010.

With many thanks in advance for your participation from the coordinator team,  Roger Davies ^talk 19:44, 17 September 2010 (UTC)

Per Lindström (logician)

Hi, is he alive? And the other fellow? Thanks. History2007 (talk) 17:50, 20 September 2010 (UTC)

Ah, I thought you knew something since you wrote "was". :-) He's probably alive. LIBRIS lists him only with a birth year - here. They in principle list a death year for dead writers, but I've often seen this information missing. He last published a book in 2002, at the age of 66. Tomas e (talk) 17:55, 20 September 2010 (UTC)

No, apparently he died in 2009, and he's no longer listed by Gothenburg University. Tomas e (talk) 17:57, 20 September 2010 (UTC)

I know nothing. I am an ignoramus.... I just know his work - a GREAT guy he was actually. So I think in terms of importance he is much more important than Tennis players, etc. I saw a reference to was so I said was. My guess was right. I guess the other fellow is alive - for now. History2007 (talk) 19:03, 20 September 2010 (UTC)

He's still listed on the webpage of his university. I'm mostly familiar with Swedish sources. Tomas e (talk) 10:43, 21 September 2010 (UTC)

Yes, I added the U of MD to the page before. Thanks, but you should probably give Lindström a higher rating. History2007 (talk) 20:31, 21 September 2010 (UTC)

Since the WPSweden project is not exclusively a biographic one, I've tended to go for importance=low for something like 90% of all biographies. I've only assigned something higher only when there's clear evidence for it. Among scientists, I've mostly used importance=mid for Swedish Nobel Prize winners (among, for example, most historical prime ministers, recent government ministers, some less notable historical kings, major industrialists, and a limited number of major sportspeople). Not that the difference between low and mid is very important, but I've tried to be consistent. In principle, I would expect such scientists to have articles in several language versions. But since your comment indicated that he's big in his field, I took the liberty of adding s&a-priority = mid to the WPBio template, because this is an assessment in a work group with a different focus. Feel free to change. Tomas e (talk) 09:35, 22 September 2010 (UTC)

Ethnic minorities in Sweden

User:Thricecube, the "author" of Ethnic minorities in Sweden removed your PROD and added a reference, a low-quality web-based source. By doing so, he disclosed that the content of the page had actually been plagiarized from that site. The page Agriculture in Sweden is copied from the same website. (from this page). He seems to be on a mission to turn every link in a couple of navigation boxes blue. --Hegvald (talk) 05:50, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

Well, if I place a PROD I don't mind see an article go... :-) The subject could definitely be written about, but I think this was an article with generalising statements and numbers without a source. Not exactly a good idea for that type of subject... Tomas e (talk) 15:21, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

Redirect from Lindome GoIF to Lindome GIF

Hi Tomas

Many thanks for the words of encouragement. I have a problem that I cannot provide a page for Lindome GIF which has previously been deleted and has a tag "This page is currently protected and can be edited only by administrators". I have provided a sister page Lindome GoIF and would like to redirect Lindome GIF to my new page. Is this something that you can sort out at your end please? Finnish Gas 11:42, 29 September 2010 (UTC) User:Finnish Gas

Sorry I'm not an admin, but I could try to look into where to put the request sometime. Tomas e (talk) 15:13, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

I added a requested move to Talk:Lindome GoIF. This is probably the correct way to get admin attention to this issue. If noone objects to the move, the blocked name should be unblocked by the admin who makes the move after the discussion time is over. Tomas e (talk) 13:57, 6 October 2010 (UTC)

Rhône valley map

Hi Tomas. Errors have been pointed out again on File:Vignobles rhone.png. See Talk:Rhône wine#Errors in image and Talk:Rhône wine#Errors in map. --Kudpung (talk) 14:42, 30 September 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for bringing it up. I notified the creator of the map on his French account using my very best Google-Translated French, see fr:Discussion utilisateur:Lofo7. :-) It's probably easier for Lofo7 to correct the error using the original software, rather than having someone edit the png file. Tomas e (talk) 14:08, 6 October 2010 (UTC)

Surprise

You surprise me, I wanted to add something like that but did not since I did not want to get into an disagreement with you ..... [5] vs [6], thanks! --Stefan ^talk 00:26, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

Yes, I assume it was the comparison between 1855 and Langton's. Well, I thought that with a history section in place, the mention of "loosely based on" with differences seemed like they could belong there in this form. Perhaps it may seem like a bit of a change of mind, but with the new edition out and a good historical source I took a renewed look at it. Actually, the most "bold" judgment in my own mind, was to actually include a list of the "top tier" wines. Tomas e (talk) 15:18, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

Nevermind, I think what you did was good, I'm just surprised. The source is a primary source BTW. I was a bit surprised of you making the list of wines also, I was in the process of making a table of all the classified wines, but it was much more complicated/time consuming than I expected and I am a bit afraid people would say I was to "bold", but if the result is not that bad of a format I will make a try to put it in, will see how it goes. --Stefan ^talk 00:13, 6 October 2010 (UTC)

Well, the entire list actually seemed a bit excessive to me, but the top tier includes some really well-known wines (e.g. Grange, Hill of Grace, Astralis). But I guess that since we have list of all classified St.-Émilion wineries, it's a bit of matter of taste where to draw the line. Although I have noticed that several of the producers of the top tiers are not distributed at all in several European countries, so not all of them are nearly as "international" in sales as top Bordeaux producers, for example. I guess that's why I only have two of the 17 wines in my own cellar. :-) There is actually another reason that I included the list of the wine: being included in the Langton classification is to me an obvious notability criteria for Australian wineries, since "not everyone" get to be on the list. So it's lot more relevant to have than lists of "every winery in state X or county Y", which we have a couple too many of. Tomas e (talk) 13:45, 6 October 2010 (UTC)

Yes, agree, and after starting to make the list (or rather table) I realised that maybe it is to large, but I will try to do it anyway for my own interest to be able to see which and how the wines in the classification have risen and fallen, if it is not to big/cumbersome .... I will try to put it in. But we will see, I do not have much time now .... I also agree on the notability factor, it at lease in my opinion give some notability to the individual wineries, and also possibly to the individual wines, at least for the top tier. So reasons for them not being distributed in Europe 1) They are mostly very new world, so they will not sell well in Europe 2) many are made for america and some at least further down in the list is hardly even sold in Australia (Noon e.g.) so there is just not enough to sell in all places and why sell in Europe when US is so big, simple (one country) and loves the style. Also I think that most of the these wines are made in much smaller quantities than e.g. Bordeaux First Growths, Grange does 7-9k cases per year and that is probably most for that list. Random picks and WP:OR google study Clonakilla does 300-7,000 cases, CHRIS RINGLAND Shiraz never more than 100, Astralis 2006 650 cases, so there just is not enough cases to justify the overhead for most countries. According to Wikipedia :-) Lafite Rothschild does about 35K cases per year, Latour 18K, Haut-Brion 10-14K. --Stefan ^talk 00:36, 7 October 2010 (UTC)

Never trust a number you read in Wikipedia. :-) Yes, something like 100,000-200,000 bottles is probably rather representative for a Bx producer. For low production numbers to ultimately explain why a wine is not found at all in most (rich) markets, I think you need to be down to around 1,000 bottles/100 cases or less. This is true for some German auction TBAs, for example, of which often a couple of hundred halfbottles are produced. Romanée-Conti, with some 400 cases per year, and La Tâche, with some 1500 cases per year, are definitely found "everywhere" in at least small quantities. Although it could be that DRC is a bit unique by preferring allocate very small quantities to many markets; their importers know that they have to be happy with what they get and it probably gives a lot of prestige to have anything at all to sell. I could imagine that for other wines, there could be a logic of individual dealers like "if I can't sell 5-10 cases per year I don't stock it". By the way, I don't think that there is much reason to create separate articles for individual wines other than Grange (with its long and interesting history), but separate sections for individual notable wines in producer articles seems justified. Tomas e (talk) 10:43, 7 October 2010 (UTC)

The market matters a lot, where I live (Singapore) there is a lot of BDX, Burgundy and Australian, but e.g. US wines is much harder to find and German wine is very scarce. Looking at Sweden which is a market we both should know well, I have access to much more Australian wine both in Supermarkets and wine shops in Singapore than in Systembolaget, even when you include the special import. Opposite for Spain, when I go home I buy Spanish wine, which is very hard to buy in Singapore, I can get Vega Sicilia (but cant pay for it :-( ) and cheap plonk^{I love wikipedia :-)}, but very little in the mid range (say 200-500 Sek). If I have heard correctly DRC have a very interesting way of forcing the buyer to buy a case of the full range to get one single bottle of Romanée-Conti (when I buy one I will tell you if it is true :-)). But then e.g. Rockford does something similar, at least for local customers. --Stefan ^talk 13:43, 7 October 2010 (UTC)

I believe that DRC stopped their mixed-case sales sometime in the 1990s when Mme Leroy was kicked out. At least I've never seen recent vintages offered on the auction market as mixed cases, but I have seen unmixed cases of other DRC wines of recent vintages. Seen - not bought or drunk... I may be crazy and I may spend way too much money on Burgundy but I'm just not that crazy! Indeed there are some seemingly "random" influences to the selection in different markets. I usually describe Belgium as "50% France, 50% rest of the world" with a really broad selection for "the rest of the world" (if you're willing to do detective work), but it is for example damn hard to find US wines, with the exception of low-end Gallo - and if I say what I honestly think of those wines I will be accused of POV, not assuming good faith and not keeping a civil tone. Much more difficult than in Sweden, where the US selection also isn't really great. So difficult, in fact, that we've usually had to substitute other New World wines of the same grape varieties when they're supposed to be included in Munskänkarna's courses. It's a lot easier to find Australian and New Zealand wines, but several of the "Langton" producers are definitely not distributed here at all. Although OZ and NZ may be more export-oriented than US, there is no obvious reason for this huge difference in availability. European wines are seldom a problem to find, since Belgium for obvious (EU) reasons has sizeable populations of (well-paid & wine-drinking) European expats of all nationalities. But comparing to Sweden, there is something to be said for being located a couple of hours' distance by car from for example Mosel, Champagne, Alsace and Burgundy. :-) Tomas e (talk) 22:19, 7 October 2010 (UTC)

Yes obviously location matters a lot, but I think that highend US wines are priced so high that in Europe we just do not have the culture to see a Sine Qua Non or some other small cult producer to be something that that you would pay thousands of dollars for (so better for the producer to sell it in US), same with some of the not as expensive but still Australian 'cult wines' (they sell in US, RP factor). In Europe we have the 'culture' to buy highend DRC or BDX first growths. I Singapore, probably due to location, there is much more history of drinking highend Aussy wines (or maybe just more Aussy expats??), therefore they are easier to find on the market. I think I can get all Langtons Exceptional wines without much trouble. Did a quick web check for the only one I do not know and I can even get a Three Rivers Shiraz 1996 (Chris Ringland Shiraz former name), but states upon request so the wine is probably not stored locally. I know that all other producers are readily available, not 100% that the Exceptional wines can be bought today, but for sure I can get them for the next release. --Stefan ^talk 00:42, 8 October 2010 (UTC)

Indian Wine

Hi Tomas, Indian Wine is one of the growing sectors in India. But due to heavy publicity from other alcohol brands specially beer and vodka. Apart from a few selected educated people who take interest in Wine, others have no taste in wine. There are more than 30+ players in India and most prominently Sula Wine and Vallee De Vin, these are actually rather promoting the wine, they have actually taken the route of educating the Indian audience. This iwas the reason why we have Vallee De Vin. With your interest in Wine, would really love your inputs on how to improve the article. Thank you User:Mokshjuneja 12:48, 11 October 2010 (UTC)

Redirect to Lindome GIF

Thanks for sorting this out Tomas. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Finnish Gas (talk • contribs) 12:24, 13 October 2010

No problems! :-) Tomas e (talk) 13:22, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

Chateau de Beaucastel

Hi Tomas. I started a page for Beaucastel about a year ago, but never got around to finishing it. My draft page is located here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Corkcollector/Ch%C3%A2teau_de_Beaucastel Please feel free to take from it whatever you think will help your page. Thanks. 67.43.137.190 (talk) 20:33, 15 October 2010 (UTC)

OK, will have a look. I didn't notice it before I created Château de Beaucastel, but I see Agne had noticed your page. Tomas e (talk) 07:48, 17 October 2010 (UTC)

I'll see if I can expand this when I get time. Beaucastel is only a couple of km from my vineyard. --Kudpung (talk) 01:24, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

Only a couple of km from Thailand??? :-) Tomas e (talk)

have three homes - one here in Thailand, one in England, and one in the heartlands of Tavel, Lirac, and CDN ;) --Kudpung (talk) 13:46, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

Talkback

Hello, Tomas e. You have new messages at Talk:Provence wine.
Message added 01:17, 23 October 2010 (UTC). You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

A rare return to wine, but somebody had to do it. If you have time, you may wish to check it over. Kudpung (talk) 01:17, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

OK, will have a look, but it won't be the next few days. Tomas e (talk) 09:56, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

The Military history WikiProject Newsletter : LV (September 2010)

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Rousseau

Thanks for fixing my gaffe with the status of Clos de la Roche, not sure how that slipped through but I'm glad you picked it up. Camw (talk) 13:51, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

Well, I had a look on a few of my Clos de la Roche bottles (from a much cheaper producer than Rousseau, unfortunately) just a few weeks ago, and then then the labels definitely said "Grand Cru"... :-). Tomas e (talk) 20:58, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

I don't own any from Rousseau either, but I did know it was Grand Cru, just made a mistake! I notice above you and Stefan discussing the Langton's Classification Wines, I'm going to have a go at getting articles made for more of the exceptional level producers, I've just finished one on Grosset - are you interested in working on any of them together? Camw (talk) 04:04, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

Good idea - I could have a look at them to see if I have anything to add, but I don't think I'll start any articles. (I have some unfinished business with a number of grape varieties I want to give priority to.) If you tag the talk pages with {{wine}}, I'll probably find them quicker compared to waiting for them being detected by NewArticleBot. Tomas e (talk) 09:06, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

The Bugle: Issue LVI, October 2010

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The Bugle: Issue LVII, November 2010

Your Military History Newsletter Project News: From the editors, "Military Historian of the Year", New Incubator, Black Project Report Articles: The month's featured and A-class Milhist content Members: Contest results, A-class medal recipients Editorial: bahamut guides us through "Nominating military biographies for deletion"

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Talkback

Hello, Tomas e. You have new messages at Hmains's talk page.
Message added 21:28, 10 December 2010 (UTC). You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

It concerns mainly defaultsort. Possibly 1,000s of articles affected. Over to you. Kudpung (talk) 21:28, 10 December 2010 (UTC)

Hello Kudpung, I understand that it looks weird, but it may actually be a correct way to get consistent sorting. One of the deficiencies of the MediaWiki software is that it actually doesn't provide for "true" alphabetical sorting. Upper and lower case letters are not sorted exactly the same (A=a - B=b - C=c ...), instead the order is (if I remember right - can't recall where this is described) something like A-a-B-b-C-c-... Thus, "ABd" and "ABz" is sorted before "Abc". Thus, a "mangled" capitalization in DEFAULTSORT may actually be a way to ensure proper alphabetical sorting, although I haven't checked out what the current recommendation looks like. As far as I understand it, this type of capitalization is not a recommendation for actual spelling in the text, it is simply a way to try to compensate for peculiarities in the MediaWiki sorting function. So it's probably nothing to worry about - it just looks weird. Tomas e (talk) 11:18, 11 December 2010 (UTC)

Pine Ridge Vineyards

Hi Tomas. Just to let you know that to be on the safe side I have prodded an article that was posted today. If the wine project is of a different opinion, please feel free to remove the PROD notice. Cheers, --Kudpung (talk) 21:17, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

Well, the article creator had unfortunately already removed it when I had a look. His contributions look like typical advertisement articles for wineries of questionable notability, so the PRODding was definitely justified. Tomas e (talk) 23:41, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

I took another look at it and put a CSD G11 on it. It's gone. BTW: Happy holidays! --Kudpung (talk) 04:31, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

The same to you! Don't forget to drink Rhône over the holidays. :-) Tomas e (talk) 14:42, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

Wine

You know much about wine? Do you know if Domaine Bargylus as mentioned here:[7] is the same as Château Bargylus in this article?: [8]

You can reply here. --Supreme Deliciousness (talk) 11:06, 26 December 2010 (UTC)

Hello, S.D., the name of the winery started in 2003 (which the "Château Bargylus" article is apparently about) seems actually to be Domaine de Bargylus, so I guess the answer is "yes". So the artice - providing that it is notable, which I haven't checked - should be moved to its correct name. Their wine is alternatively referred to as Domaine de Bargylus or just Bargylus by the wine trade; I don't find a "Château de Bargylus". Actually, Domaine and Château are roughly equivalent terms for French wine producers (both may only produce wine from their own vineyards), although favoured in different regions. Tomas e (talk) 21:50, 26 December 2010 (UTC)